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Poster: "David H Ritterskamp" <dhritter@dpcmail.dukepower.com>

     On Mon, 14 Apr 97, "Terry L. Neill" <Neilltl@ptsc.slg.eds.com> wrote:
     >Poster: "Terry L. Neill" <Neilltl@ptsc.slg.eds.com>
     >>(As opposed to the Old-timers;
     >>I'm an OTimer and I don't know, so the Ancients must...;>)
     >Define OTimers.  How many years is that?
     [I heard somewhere awhile back that average life expectancy in the SCA 
     was around three years.  I guess I define Old-Timer as more than about 
     six years, depending on the circle of people you move in.  I'm sure 
     that there are plenty of people out there for whom six years is a drop 
     in the bucket.  Counting from my first event, I hit 10 years this 
     February.  YMMV.]
     >>I think we've fairly well established the fact that shires can't 
     give awards;
     >>now let's see if we can move along up the ladder.
     >No we haven't.  We have, in fact, established the opposite.
     >ANYONE can give 'awards'.  I could go start the Anarra Karlsdottir 
     Group of
     >Great Folks.  Symbol:  A norse necklace dangly with red, black and 
     gold beads.
     >Mind you, this 'award' would carry absolutely no prescedence in any 
     >All it would say is that Anarra Karlsdottir thinks you is Great 
     [And there are examples within this thread of non-precedence bearing 
     awards that people value highly.  Change that sentence to read "I 
     think we've...shires can't give Officially Recognized Awards."  Is 
     that better?
     Come to think of it, the seneschale of Crannog Mor at the time gave 
     out the award of the Order of the Bear Buns (you sort of had to be 
     there) with the preface that it didn't count for anything official.  
     AFAIK, it was never given out again.]
     >And that is the kind of 'award' any shire, canton, province, college, 
     etc, can
     >give.  These groups are not allowed to have *prescedence bearing* 
     awards.  But
     >that doesn't make them meaningless.
     [*deep breath* ARGH...I knew this was probably going to happen.  
     Re-read my earlier post about whether people with/without awards were 
     worth knowing.  I'm NOT trying to say that in order to be worth 
     knowing, you have to have Officially Recognized Awards; I'm saying 
     that if you don't have Officially Recognized Awards, your CHANCES of 
     being a Recognized Authority or Talent are much lower.  AT NO POINT 
     EVERYBODY CAN QUIT TELLING ME THIS, thank you very much.]
     >If the Barony of Clay Feet gave their Order of the Iron Oxide to any 
     >fool, and the Shire of Serene Sisters gave their non-official award 
     only to
     >those truely deserving, which do you think people would come to value 
     It's already been pretty much shown, IMO, that if nobody knew about 
     the Shire of Serene Sisters' unofficial award, people would value the 
     Order of the Iron Oxide more by default.
     >For that matter, how different is the hypothetical Group of Great 
     Folks from
     >the tokens Laurels and non-Laurels leave with A&S entries that strike 
     Absolutely none.  And very few people know about the tokens, either.  
     They're not PUBLICIZED.
     Ld. Jonathan Blackbow

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