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Poster: Beverly Robinson-Curry <corvus2@worldnet.att.net> Received: from workstation ([12.69.123.46]) by mtiwmhc02.worldnet.att.net (InterMail v03.02.03 118 118 102) with SMTP id <19980605014224.RGNW28960@workstation> for <corvus2@worldnet.att.net>; Fri, 5 Jun 1998 01:42:24 +0000 Message-ID: <35774F64.7A17@worldnet.att.net> Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 21:52:36 -0400 From: Beverly Robinson-Curry <corvus2@worldnet.att.net> X-Mailer: Mozilla 3.0C-WorldNet (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: corvus2@worldnet.att.net Subject: [Fwd: May 1998 LoAR] Content-Type: message/rfc822 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit Content-Disposition: inline Received: from camel8.mindspring.com ([207.69.200.58]) by mtiwgwc03.worldnet.att.net (Intermail v3.1 117 241) with ESMTP id <19980604235230.DTJO11198@camel8.mindspring.com> for <corvus2@worldnet.att.net>; Thu, 4 Jun 1998 23:52:30 +0000 Received: from default (pool-207-205-219-53.pbgh.grid.net [207.205.219.53]) by camel8.mindspring.com (8.8.5/8.8.5) with ESMTP id TAA23836 for <corvus2@worldnet.att.net>; Thu, 4 Jun 1998 19:52:27 -0400 (EDT) Message-ID: <35773244.17D8A326@mindspring.com> Date: Thu, 04 Jun 1998 19:48:20 -0400 From: Tom Bilodeau <tirloch@mindspring.com> X-Mailer: Mozilla 4.01 [en] (Win95; U) MIME-Version: 1.0 To: Rhiannon <corvus2@worldnet.att.net> Subject: May 1998 LoAR X-Priority: 3 (Normal) Content-Type: text/plain; charset=iso-8859-1 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-MIME-Autoconverted: from 8bit to quoted-printable by camel8.mindspring.com id TAA23836 Dear Triton! Herewith are the May LoAR acceptances followed by the detailed returns! Edit them as you see fit for publication! Tirloch =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D May 1998 LoAR Acceptances: =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Afanasiia Volokhovna. Badge. Argent, a wolf's head erased sable within an annulet azure. Alesia Gillefalyn. Device change. Per chevron inverted engrailed argent and sable, a rose purpure barbed and seeded proper and a lion couchant guardant Or. Her former device Per bend argent and sable, a rose purpure barbed and seeded proper and a lion couchant guardant Or) is hereby released. Alys Montgomerie. Badge. (Fieldless) A goblet per pale Or and sable sustained between two talbots combattant Or and sable. Anna Sabyn of Bordeaux. Name and device. Vert, a winged lion rampant, a chief embattled Or. Bianca Isotta Viscari. Device. Gules, a branch of mistletoe Or, berries argent, on a bordure Or three lozenges gules. Bran Trefonin. Badge. (Fieldless) Three birds close conjoined in annulo argent. Brianna Buchanan. Name and device. Sable, a winged wolf segreant to sinister argent, in chief three pairs of swords crossed in saltire Or. Brianna O'Dinneen. Name and device. Argent, on a lozenge purpure a decrescent argent, a chief dovetailed sable. Cassandra the Forlorn. Name and device. Per fess engrailed argent and sable, two crescents gules and a natural dolphin naiant argent. Daniela Schwartzhaupt. Name and device. Vert, a domestic cat sejant between three needles bendwise sinister argent. Dionisia de Vere. Name and device. Vert, an open book argent sustained by a hand couped at the wrist proper, on a chief Or three frogs sejant to sinister vert. George Bowie. Name. Glumr Kveldulfssen. Name. Jenet Fairhaugh. Name and device. Argent, a bend between six maple leaves vert. Nice armory! Marinus, Barony of. Badge for the Award of the Marlin. Per pale vert and azure, two marlins haurient respectant in chevron argent. Nikulai Ivanovich. Name. =D8pi V=E1li. Name. Robert Drake. Name. Rosalie of Rosethorne Castle. Badge. Purpure, a tower within an annulet of thorns argent. S=E9amus =D3 Cuile=E1in. Name. Signy Feilan Bjarnard=F3ttir. Badge. (Fieldless) A turtle tergiant argent. S=EDle nic Ch=E1rthaigh. Name. Sine n=ED Dheaghaidh. Badge. (Fieldless) A honeybee argent. Susanna Grey. Device. Sable, a decrescent argent, a chief vairy vert and Or. Swieczka Kaim. Device. Per chevron sable and gules, on a demi-sun Or issuant from base, a sprig fesswise vert. Vincenza da Gubbio. Name. William MacGregor. Name. May 1998 LoAR Returns: =3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D=3D Alesia Gillefalyn. Badge. (Fieldless) A lion courant guardant Or holding in its mouth a rose purpure slipped and leaved vert. This conflicts with Conrad von Hammerbourg, Per chevron rayonny sable and gules, in base a catamount herissony proper., with one CD for fieldlessness, but nothing for position against a fieldless badge, and nothing for the minor change in position. Catherine Delacroix. Badge. (Fieldless) Four ankhs conjoined in cross Or. This conflicts with Launcelot de Westwood Azure, a cross botonny fitchy Or., with one for fieldlessness, but nothing for type since the fitching of the cross is worth nothing and this cross is about halfway between a cross-crosslet and a cross bottony, which itself is actually just a fossilized difference in blazon for poorly drawn examples of the cross crosslet. If an ankhs was used in period armory we might have ruled differently, but since it is not a period charge, it loses the benefit of the doubt. Conall Ruadh Mag Fhionnain. Device. Per pale argent and azure, two serpents glissant respectant, conjoined at the snout and belly, counterchanged gules and Or. This is being returned for violating RfS VII.7.b by being in an unblazonable position. The submitted blazon does not accurately reproduce this emblazon, and no one in the college was able to come up with an acceptable blazon that could. D=E1lkr H=E1lftroll Snjolfsson. Device resubmission. Sable, a horse's sk= ull affronty Or, flaunches argent estencely gules. This is a resubmission of the same device which was returned November 1997 for a redraw because the horse's skull was unidentifiable. Unfortunately, it was the overwhelming conclusion of both the college and the people attending the roadshow where this was discussed that this is still unidentifiable, carefully drawn as it is. This compels us to the conclusion that the horse=92s skull does not have such clearly distinguishing features as to make it acceptably identifiable for heraldic use. The human skull used in Society and mundane heraldry is a clearly defined charge as immediately identifiable as a bend or a sword. (Consider how instantly children who have never taken an anatomy course identify it at Halloween!) The Society has extended definitions of skulls to certain beasts where there are secondary characteristics that clearly identify the type of head whence the skull derived. For instance, the ram=92s skull is identified by its distinctive horns, as ar= e the elk=92s skull, the bull=92s skull, the deer=92s skull, etc. The few exceptions to that rule occurred almost twenty years ago, before standards for identifiability were so clearly defined. Even so, the major exception, the wolf=92s skull registered to Vargskol Halfblood passed in the confusion of the great Heraldicon of 1979, the source of many of the most solecistic items we see in the Armorial today. In judging this, we have to ask what features uniquely identify a horse=92s head from any other head and ask how clearly those transfer when the soft tissue is removed. Unfortunately, almost all of the features, except the length of the upper jaw, disappear entirely when head becomes skull. Therefore, the skull is not identifiable. D=E1lkr H=E1lftroll Snjolfsson. Badge. Or, a horse's skull gules between flaunches sable. This is a resubmission of the same badge which was returned November 1997 for a redraw because the horse's skull was unidentifiable. Unfortunately, it was the overwhelming conclusion of both the college and the people attending the roadshow where this was discussed that this is still unidentifiable, carefully drawn as it is. This compels us to the conclusion that the horse=92s skull does not have such clearly distinguishing features as to make it acceptably identifiable for heraldic use. The human skull used in Society and mundane heraldry is a clearly defined charge as immediately identifiable as a bend or a sword. (Consider how instantly children who have never taken an anatomy course identify it at Halloween!) The Society has extended definitions of skulls to certain beasts where there are secondary characteristics that clearly identify the type of head whence the skull derived. For instance, the ram=92s skull is identified by its distinctive horns, as ar= e the elk=92s skull, the bull=92s skull, the deer=92s skull, etc. The few exceptions to that rule occurred almost twenty years ago, before standards for identifiability were so clearly defined. Even so, the major exception, the wolf=92s skull registered to Vargskol Halfblood passed in the confusion of the great Heraldicon of 1979, the source of many of the most solecistic items we see in the Armorial today. In judging this, we have to ask what features uniquely identify a horse=92s head from any other head and ask how clearly those transfer when the soft tissue is removed. Unfortunately, almost all of the features, except the length of the upper jaw, disappear entirely when head becomes skull. Therefore, the skull is not identifiable. Giovanni Rocco. Badge. Azure, three bendlets Or, overall a tower argent. This conflicts with Anne of the White Tower Sable, a tower argent., as cited on the LoI. It was not unusual for barry or paly fields in period to be drawn with an odd number of traits (which we'd blazon as bars or palets); see, for example, the arms of Mouton (Multon, Moleton) found both as Barry argent and gules and Argent, three bars gules (;;;DBA, pp 59, 88; Foster, p. 145). The same thing is found in the arms of von Rosenberg, whose Per fess field has in base either three bends or bendy depending upon the artist's whim (Siebmacher, p. 8; Neubecker and Rentzmann, p. 290). Even when the distinction is worth blazoning, it's worth no difference. Mieszko Ziel=E9nski. Badge. Per bend azure and vert, a bend between two roundels argent. This conflicts with Ailith of Sarum Per bend azure and vert, a bend between a cross crosslet and a sprig argent., with only one CD for the type of secondaries. Nikulai Ivanovich. Device. Per chevron argent and vert, in chief a fox courant to sinister gules. This conflicts with Sherry Foxwell (Fieldless) A fox herissony to sinister gules., as cited on the LoI. There is one CD for fieldlessness, but nothing for the slight change in posture. S=E9amus =D3 Cuile=E1in. Device. Vert, a cross formy rounded Or within a stag's attires, a bordure raguly argent. While blazoned on the LoI as a cross formy rounded, there is no such cross. One commentor suggested that this be reblazoned as a cross alis=E9e. The cross alis=E9e is a roundel with four narrow wedges, with straight sides, in saltire cut not quite to the center. In this proposed design the =91cross=92 has four wedges, with slightly curved sid= es, in saltire cut not quite to the center. This is neither a cross formy not a cross alis=E9e, but a hybrid of the two. However, a cross looking like the one submitted above has been submitted before, though not by the same person, during the tenure of Master Bruce as Laurel. At that time he said. "[A cross "formy convexed"] This badge had been returned on the LoAR of May 92 for lack of documentation on the type of cross. (It had been blazoned in the previous submission as a cross formy globate, which term we couldn't find in any of our references.) The submitter has appealed that return, providing evidence of this cross as an artistic motif on a suit of armor c.1630. The term "convexed", referring to the bulge of the outer edges of the cross's limbs, is documented in Elvin's Dictionary of Heraldry. Unfortunately, my main concerns about this cross remain unaddressed. Its not readily blazonable: as drawn, it resembles a roundel with four semi-elliptical notches, not a variant of a cross formy. Its been documented only to within our 50-year "grey area", and only as an artistic motif, not an heraldic charge. The only terms that adequately describe it are found in a 19th Century work, compiled by an author whose lack of scholarship is legend. I simply have no grounds for believing this cross to be compatible with period heraldic style. This cross has been submitted before, and returned for the above reasons; v. Jamys Ellyn Rothesay of Bannatyne Hall, LoAR of Sept 92, p.49. I'm tempted, I admit, to simply give the cross its own SCA name. (In the immortal words of Baldwin of Erebor, "Spring is in the air, and the fit is upon me; let me name but one cross before I die!") But this would do no service to the heralds and scribes who will follow us; we need some assurance that any blazon we devised would be reconstructible. In this case, at the very least we need to find this cross mentioned by name in some accessible reference. Failing that, or better evidence that its a period motif, I must continue to return it. (Stanislaw Jan Ossolinski, March, 1993, pg. 28)" Since no evidence has been presented for this cross, we see no reason to overturn this precedent. Una of Aire Faucon. Badge. Gules, a bend embowed-counterembowed between two bears statant argent. This is being returned for a redraw. While the bend was emblazoned as bowed-counterembowed, the embowing was so slight to be barely seen. The embowing must be drawn more boldly. William MacGregor. Device. Ermine, on a pale sable a dexter gauntlet clenched apaumy Or. This conflicts with Karl Adler der Reisender Lozengy gules and Or, on a pale sable, a dexter gauntlet appaumy argent., which gets a CD for the field but nothing for tincture only of the tertiary (the clenching is an artistic detail which does not contribute difference). ======================================================================= List Archives, FAQ, FTP: http://merryrose.atlantia.sca.org/ Submissions: atlantia@atlantia.sca.org Admin. requests: majordomo@atlantia.sca.org
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